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Author Topic: Esseesse Oil  (Read 5638 times)

Offline sandys

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Esseesse Oil
« on: May 29, 2012, 12:31:37 pm »
Can anyone confirm the the oil for the multiair esseesse, had my 18k service at the Bristol dealer the other day and they have put in 10/50, I'm pretty sure this is wrong and they are sure its right, how do I get proof of which is correct?

There stance is that it's an esseesse it needs 10/50, but far as I can see 10/50 doesn't meet min specs ACEA C3 or grade 5/40 for multiar.

Pretty fed up with dealing with this dealer what with damaging my car and the lack of expediancy of the the repair, then the amount of confidence they don't fill me with on the service items.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 12:35:53 pm by sandys »

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    Offline John501

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #1 on: May 29, 2012, 12:39:07 pm »
    I've just had the same conversation with our Master Tech this morning.
    The Multi air Evo MUST ONLY have the specific 5w40 Selina oil designed for that engine.
    10w50 is too thick for hydraulic valves.
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    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #2 on: May 29, 2012, 12:41:33 pm »
    I've just had the same conversation with our Master Tech this morning.
    The Multi air Evo MUST ONLY have the specific 5w40 Selina oil designed for that engine.
    10w50 is too thick for hydraulic valves.

    They are telling me they have charts on the wall that have 10/50 and the computer tells them 10/50, how do I prove otherwise?

    I mentioned that the car does not need 10/50 when I took it in too which is annoying.

    Offline John501

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #3 on: May 29, 2012, 12:51:37 pm »
    Their computer system "E-Sigi" will tell them that a multi air engine must have 5w40
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    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #4 on: May 29, 2012, 12:52:32 pm »
    I will see if I can get them to check that

    Also I am supposed to be spanking this thing around Cadwell Park tomorrow, I'm not sure that is wise with this oil in, in a normal engine I would go with the 10/50w as it probably works well in the extremes the car would be running at, don't know what the impact is on these multiair gubbins though.

    Offline John501

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #5 on: May 29, 2012, 12:53:18 pm »
    I dont know.
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    Offline JamesSS

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #6 on: May 29, 2012, 02:09:45 pm »
    It'll be thicker on cold starts, so just give it a bit more time to get up to temperature before you think about giving it any juice. If you're ragging it around Cadwell, I'd assume the 10w50 would provide just as much protection (if not more) as the recommended oil - but then, I'm sure the manufacturers know more than about their engine than I do.

    Personally, I'd do the track day on this oil, then get the dealership to replace it with the correct spec oil free of charge. Then you've got fresh oil after a track day, bonus! :thumb:

    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #7 on: May 29, 2012, 02:15:37 pm »
    I called them up again and they told me about checking with Petronas and Petronas have said it's 10/50, the thing is they told me this on my 9k oil change after I convinced them the car needed an oil change at 9k, as they told me it didn't  ::) this was when my car was stock and without any doubt required the 5w/40 stated in the manual, can't trust them.

    That when I brought the car to Vospers for the 9k service and subsequent Esseesse kit fit as at least you guys have some knowledge on the car but popping to Plymouth to get a job done right is hardly convenient, then again niether is this, it shouldn't be this hard to service a vehicle.

    JamesSS, I was thinking along your lines, but like you don't know the impact, I use stop start a lot, so the correct oil grade is probably quite important, strangely since the service the car has not started correctly twice from a stop start scenario and its always been perfect, it gets used 3-5 times a day, so I know it well, which does make me wonder.....but at the same time I am also using A/C which I don't normally do and it could be the impact of the loading from that and juts a coincidence.
    « Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 02:25:02 pm by sandys »

    Offline John501

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #8 on: May 29, 2012, 02:29:11 pm »
    This is in no way an official response but the opinion of our master tech is:
    In the short term it should cause no damage especially as you are going to get it very hot on the track day. That should thin the oil out enough to allow the actuators to work properly.

    If you left it in longer term that's where you may get issues. The thicker oil will not work the actuators from dead cold so you may get starting problems or running problems due to the actuators not opening or closing the valves properly.
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    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #9 on: May 29, 2012, 02:37:17 pm »
    Cheers Jon, I'm going to pop down there now and have a face to face with them as I am not happy to be honest.

    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #10 on: May 29, 2012, 04:10:26 pm »
    Well it's still inconclusive, they are happy with what's in my car, they have asked for further clarification,that's all I can ask of them really.

    Interesting side note back page of the esseesse supplement has a picture of 10/50 Selenia Abarth, so couldtheybe right onthisone?

    olopboy

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #11 on: May 29, 2012, 04:12:01 pm »
    The same picture is in all the handbooks so stock image would be my guess as the handbook is quite clear on the oil to use in the maintenance section
    « Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 04:13:36 pm by Chris555 »

    Offline John501

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #12 on: May 29, 2012, 04:24:01 pm »
    The clue's are on the tin, the 5w40 oil clearly states "For use in multi air engines"
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    Offline sandys

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #13 on: May 29, 2012, 09:57:28 pm »
    I mentioned this when I was in there today, they checked with the brand manager Paul who also claims it is 10/50w, I have no way to prove other wise.

    On the petronas site it tells you 10/50 for all Abarth cars fitted with the kit and 5/40 for cars with multair, which makes it clear as mud, what oil do you put in a multiair fitted with kit  ::)

    I personally think I have the wrong oil in my car as there is not a 10/50 on the market that conforms to ACEA C3, anything that conforms to that standard is either 0/30, 5/30 or 5/40 oils with appropriate high temperature and high shear which is higher performance oil than normal oils, this is what the ACEA C3 standard gets it.

    Of course I am unlikely to find out about any damage the current oil could be doing until way down the line, most likely when I am out of warranty  ::)
    « Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 09:59:04 pm by sandys »

    Offline lloyd

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    Re: Esseesse Oil
    « Reply #14 on: May 29, 2012, 10:10:47 pm »
    the multi air oil spec is necessitated by the hydraulic valve actuation, this doesn't change if the SS kit is fitted, how can it?

    so it has to be multi air oil for multi air engines.

    go to Stanford Hall on Sunday and we'll all collar Mr Abarth UK, he likes things like this ;D